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What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?


BoztheMadman
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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Now that would be a great Boxing match, one that Boxing purists would've loved to have seen. Calzone would've been one of Ward's greatest opponents, as far as pure boxing skills. Ward, like BHop would've given him a great fight, however, Ward has a better punch, and I'm sure he'd have Cal hurting at times. Yeah, Cal had a great jaw, but I think he'd be worn down by Ward's superior defense, and speed. The beginning of the fight would be very much like a high level chess match, both fighters scoring light punches in the match, and exchanging flurries. The first third of the match would be split evenly between the two, but I think when the middle comes, Andre will start frustrating Cal, making him miss, while landing decisive counter punches.

 

By the late rounds, 9-10, I see Ward being ahead by a 4 points, with Cal still not being too far away. I believe in round 10, Cal would be able to get a knockdown on Ward, and win a good 10-8 round, with the 11th being a tie. When the 12th comes, Ward will have recovered enough, and would come out strong, landing great counters. I think it'd be a late stoppage, or a close SD win for Andre Ward. Who... funny enough, probably would've given Calzone a rematch, and even agreed to fight in Wales.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Now that would be a great Boxing match, one that Boxing purists would've loved to have seen. Calzone would've been one of Ward's greatest opponents, as far as pure boxing skills. Ward, like BHop would've given him a great fight, however, Ward has a better punch, and I'm sure he'd have Cal hurting at times. Yeah, Cal had a great jaw, but I think he'd be worn down by Ward's superior defense, and speed. The beginning of the fight would be very much like a high level chess match, both fighters scoring light punches in the match, and exchanging flurries. The first third of the match would be split evenly between the two, but I think when the middle comes, Andre will start frustrating Cal, making him miss, while landing decisive counter punches.

 

By the late rounds, 9-10, I see Ward being ahead by a 4 points, with Cal still not being too far away. I believe in round 10, Cal would be able to get a knockdown on Ward, and win a good 10-8 round, with the 11th being a tie. When the 12th comes, Ward will have recovered enough, and would come out strong, landing great counters. I think it'd be a late stoppage, or a close SD win for Andre Ward. Who... funny enough, probably would've given Calzone a rematch, and even agreed to fight in Wales.

 

Ward by stoppage and then traveling outside of the US? Neither would happen. Ward can't break eggs and he gets a nosebleed just thinking of crossing oceans.

 

Joe Calzaghe on points by a couple of rounds. Ward is more hype than substance.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Eh, okay. Your opinion is just as valid as mine, except a bit more informed I think, lol.

 

All opinions are valid :)

 

Andre Ward had the World at his feet after 2011 but through inactivity has stumbled badly. He is only 30 so time is on his side but he needs to get back in the ring and start beating top opposition.

 

He's had two stoppage victories in his last 10 fights - so hardly evidence that he stops Joe Calzaghe, who had never been stopped. Calzaghe at his best, without the hand problems, is too busy for Andre.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Ward by stoppage and then traveling outside of the US? Neither would happen. Ward can't break eggs and he gets a nosebleed just thinking of crossing oceans.

 

Joe Calzaghe on points by a couple of rounds. Ward is more hype than substance.

I feel the same-the chance that Ward would stop Joe is as big as...Malignaggi knocking out a champion. It would be a 115-113 decision for Joe. Wether or not anybody would get knocked down is not certain. Joe was down against Bhop and RJ but both times it was a flash kd and those two guys are faster than Ward.

Edited by BoztheMadman
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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

I think some fans get carried away with Joe's resume - but if you look at it in detail - its not great. Its good but not great. For me Joe's "prime" was the Lacy win, the Bika defence and the Kessler fight. Although Joe had defended the WBO belt against all-comers up until the Lacy fight (98-06), the all-comers were a bit like Klitschko's situation now. Not all that. And then some, but thats not Joe's fault - just very fortunate/convenient.

 

Joe's career-defining fight was Lacy - who no one expected him to beat - certainly not me. Some Joe-haters say Lacy was over the hill, I say not. And the next fight - the Bika defence was also a tremendous victory. Then you have to ask yourself why Joe threw the IBF belt up at a time when Bute was appearing on the scene? Joe made a ridiculous defence for the WBO strap against the awful Manfredo Jr (and to this day I dont know what qualified Peter to get a title shot) in the April as Bute beat Bika in the IBF eliminator in June.

 

So then we come to the Kessler fight, which was surely also a great victory for Joe. You cant count the B'Hop and Jones Jr figts as anything more than novelty value as both were past-it, they were non-title fights and lets not forget Joe was on his arse in the 1st round in both fights. So for me, Joe's prime was mid 2006 till late 2007 across 3+1 (manfredo) fights - which for me - doesn't make him a "great".

 

So lets compare Joe's prime to Andre's.

 

For me Andre's style and his blueprint, was perfected against the hard hitting Miranda in 2009 and he has boxed with the same style ever since. Therefore a much longer prime period than Joe. Save for Pudwill, look at Ward's resume since 2009: Kessler, Green, Bika, Abraham, Froch (who gets lauded on here and never won a round against Ward), Dawson and Rodriguez. A list of opponents a country mile better than Joe's from 98-06. And in a shorter time-space.

 

Conclusion? I think Andre outboxes and outstyles Joe by points. But thats just my opinion.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

I think some fans get carried away with Joe's resume - but if you look at it in detail - its not great. Its good but not great. For me Joe's "prime" was the Lacy win, the Bika defence and the Kessler fight. Although Joe had defended the WBO belt against all-comers up until the Lacy fight (98-06), the all-comers were a bit like Klitschko's situation now. Not all that. And then some, but thats not Joe's fault - just very fortunate/convenient.

 

Joe's career-defining fight was Lacy - who no one expected him to beat - certainly not me. Some Joe-haters say Lacy was over the hill, I say not. And the next fight - the Bika defence was also a tremendous victory. Then you have to ask yourself why Joe threw the IBF belt up at a time when Bute was appearing on the scene? Joe made a ridiculous defence for the WBO strap against the awful Manfredo Jr (and to this day I dont know what qualified Peter to get a title shot) in the April as Bute beat Bika in the IBF eliminator in June.

 

So then we come to the Kessler fight, which was surely also a great victory for Joe. You cant count the B'Hop and Jones Jr figts as anything more than novelty value as both were past-it, they were non-title fights and lets not forget Joe was on his arse in the 1st round in both fights. So for me, Joe's prime was mid 2006 till late 2007 across 3+1 (manfredo) fights - which for me - doesn't make him a "great".

 

So lets compare Joe's prime to Andre's.

 

For me Andre's style and his blueprint, was perfected against the hard hitting Miranda in 2009 and he has boxed with the same style ever since. Therefore a much longer prime period than Joe. Save for Pudwill, look at Ward's resume since 2009: Kessler, Green, Bika, Abraham, Froch (who gets lauded on here and never won a round against Ward), Dawson and Rodriguez. A list of opponents a country mile better than Joe's from 98-06. And in a shorter time-space.

 

Conclusion? I think Andre outboxes and outstyles Joe by points. But thats just my opinion.

 

Forget the bloody resume! It's not who he beat but what he showed in those fights-total dominance and ability to adapt to any of his opponent's styles and read them all. How many can do that? Only great boxers. I'm really sick and tired of people going on and on about how his resume is not so good. Well, I got news for you-to beat Chris Eubank, even THAT version, is not easy. Nobody ever beat him easily. And to come to America and beat a guy like Bernard Hopkins isn't easy either. Or to take on a red hot destroyer like Kessler and beat him. If this is not a proof enough how great he was, then I think you will never get it.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Or to take on a red hot destroyer like Kessler and beat him

 

When did i disagree with this statement in my post? I said about Kessler: "which was surely also a great victory for Joe."

 

My whole point is (in a nutshell), Calzaghe had from 98-06 probably the biggest string of tomato cans in boxing history to defend against (similar to the Klitschko situation now) but Ward has had a string of talent to defend against inc the "future HOF-er Froch" who never won a round against him.

 

Joe was in his prime for 3 fights over 18mths. Ward much longer and against classier opposition. Which is why I think Ward wins Pts Cls.

 

Boz, just because I see it differently to you doesn't make me wrong. Our opinions differ, and we are both neither right or wrong.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

When did i disagree with this statement in my post? I said about Kessler: "which was surely also a great victory for Joe."

 

My whole point is (in a nutshell), Calzaghe had from 98-06 probably the biggest string of tomato cans in boxing history to defend against (similar to the Klitschko situation now) but Ward has had a string of talent to defend against inc the "future HOF-er Froch" who never won a round against him.

 

Joe was in his prime for 3 fights over 18mths. Ward much longer and against classier opposition. Which is why I think Ward wins Pts Cls.

 

Boz, just because I see it differently to you doesn't make me wrong. Our opinions differ, and we are both neither right or wrong.

 

That is to completely ignore that Chris Eubank, Robin Reid, Omar Sheika, Richie woodhall, Mario Veit, Charles Brewer, Byron Mitchell, were all worthy contenders/challengers at the time Joe beat them. (98-06)

 

Two of Ward's best wins came against former Calzaghe victims i.e Kessler and Bika. Edison Miranda was past it and the type of guy Ward should be stopping, also Allan Green was overhyped. Chad Dawson weight drained, Arthur Abraham not a legit SM. That basically leaves a great win over Carl Froch and a win over the Rodriguez. Throw in Shelby Pudwill and Henry Buchanan, who weren't World Class.

 

Ward is effective but like I said needs to start fighting.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

When did i disagree with this statement in my post? I said about Kessler: "which was surely also a great victory for Joe."

 

My whole point is (in a nutshell), Calzaghe had from 98-06 probably the biggest string of tomato cans in boxing history to defend against (similar to the Klitschko situation now) but Ward has had a string of talent to defend against inc the "future HOF-er Froch" who never won a round against him.

 

Joe was in his prime for 3 fights over 18mths. Ward much longer and against classier opposition. Which is why I think Ward wins Pts Cls.

 

Boz, just because I see it differently to you doesn't make me wrong. Our opinions differ, and we are both neither right or wrong.

 

No-you are wrong, I am right. :mlol: Don't pull that old "different opinions" song, I've heard it too many times. ;-)

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

My whole point is (in a nutshell), Calzaghe had from 98-06 probably the biggest string of tomato cans in boxing history to defend against (similar to the Klitschko situation now)

 

Except for the fact Klitschko has taken on pretty much everyone in his division and made a serious effort to unify and rule, while Calzaghe didn't.

 

As for Kessler being a red-hot destroyer, I think that's rather generous - he'd got some good wins, was a good fighter but still a relative newcomer to the elite level, and the guys he was going through inside the distance were generally lesser fighters.

 

Kessler's main threat was his completeness rather than his power - he could do it all, though was arguably a bit too keen in straight lines at that stage.

 

If Dirrell hadn't turned into a deluded fraud and Ward hadn't wasted so much of his time, I think the super-middle division could have looked very different now.

 

Anyway, Calzaghe beats Ward for me - even though Ward has looked sensational at times, he's never really done it against a world-class boxer; the Kessler fight was a fouling, mauling mess of a bout.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Except for the fact Klitschko has taken on pretty much everyone in his division and made a serious effort to unify and rule, while Calzaghe didn't.

 

As for Kessler being a red-hot destroyer, I think that's rather generous - he'd got some good wins, was a good fighter but still a relative newcomer to the elite level, and the guys he was going through inside the distance were generally lesser fighters.

 

Kessler's main threat was his completeness rather than his power - he could do it all, though was arguably a bit too keen in straight lines at that stage.

 

If Dirrell hadn't turned into a deluded fraud and Ward hadn't wasted so much of his time, I think the super-middle division could have looked very different now.

 

Anyway, Calzaghe beats Ward for me - even though Ward has looked sensational at times, he's never really done it against a world-class boxer; the Kessler fight was a fouling, mauling mess of a bout.

 

Calzaghe tried and fought in Denmark and Germany, to try and drum up interest against his rivals. Beyer and Ottke had no interest in facing Calzaghe and turned down offers. We can argue about the validity of the offers, but not about Joe going over to Europe. It was only Kessler that was tempted by the money.

 

Klitschko has kinda taken on everyone, in the division, but blew and avoided a shot at Lennox early on. Wlad has had a steady stream of less than decent opponents. How many would you call World Class?

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Beyer and Ottke had no interest in facing Calzaghe and turned down offers.

 

First I've heard about Beyer but Ottke I'm happy to acknowledge wanted no part of Calzaghe, and rightly so - he'd have lost every round. But Calzaghe made things worse for himself by constantly talking up fights against the likes of Woods, Johnson and then not bothering, and finishing his career by doing the sort of cynical matchmaking we'd all blamed Warren for.

 

Klitschko has kinda taken on everyone, in the division, but blew and avoided a shot at Lennox early on. Wlad has had a steady stream of less than decent opponents. How many would you call World Class?

Any evidence for him having a shot at Lennox? Lewis opted to fight Vitali and we know what happened there and the decisions he made. Other than that, he wasn't exactly chasing superfights was he? Just Tyson for the money and then Vitali because of a cancellation.

 

Much of Wlad's opposition has been pathetic, but my point is that's a reflection of the division as a whole rather than cherrypicking - he's fought almost everyone, it's just almost everyone has been shit. Povetkin, Thompson, Chagaev and I suppose Haye is about the lot. Well, and Corrie Sanders and Lamon Brewster perhaps...

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

That is to completely ignore that Chris Eubank, Robin Reid, Omar Sheika, Richie woodhall, Mario Veit, Charles Brewer, Byron Mitchell, were all worthy contenders/challengers at the time Joe beat them. (98-06)

 

Two of Ward's best wins came against former Calzaghe victims i.e Kessler and Bika. Edison Miranda was past it and the type of guy Ward should be stopping, also Allan Green was overhyped. Chad Dawson weight drained, Arthur Abraham not a legit SM. That basically leaves a great win over Carl Froch and a win over the Rodriguez. Throw in Shelby Pudwill and Henry Buchanan, who weren't World Class.

 

Ward is effective but like I said needs to start fighting.

 

Precisely my point also. Ward hasn't yet proven himself FOR REAL. Same people who give Calzaghe hard time over lack of great opponents are ignoring this on Ward's behalf. Know what thats called? Hypocrisy!

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  • 7 months later...

Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Ward by decision. I see Calzaghe winning the first 2 rounds, maybe a couple later on by sheer activity. But then Ward would have figured him out, picked him apart.

But it would have been a great fight, thats for sure.

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Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

The Calzaghe that beat Eubank would have no problem beating Ward. The Calzaghe that was beating fighters past their prime and realised it was time to retire would struggle and the fight could go either way.

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  • 3 months later...

Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Coming from a Welshman...I cant decide. I think it would be extremely close. Both are fast, both dont punch very hard. Joe Calzaghe has a better engine and is more gritty. But Ward is a better technician and has better defense. 50/50 for me

 

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

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  • 8 months later...

Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

I would have to go with Ward, he`s just to sharp and technical. Although i would be curious to see how Ward would have dealt with his activity, throwing punches in bunches.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Re: What if Calzaghe fought against Ward?

 

Great fright, I think it's not an easy prediction. Calzaghe had a great workrate and Ward a perfect timing, both had one difficult style to decode . For me it would be a very close fight with a split/majority decision verdict

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  • 5 weeks later...

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