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My Analysis of Floyd Mayweather Jr's career


londoner
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My Analysis of Floyd Mayweather Jr's career:

 

I feel i have been fair in my views and analysis of the topic and have kept to accurate time lines. But, feel free to tell me i'm wrong if you disagree.

 

Floyd made his pro debut in 1996.

 

He remained at super featherweight until 2002. During this time the two other great champions were Acelino Freitas and Joel Casmayor. He didn't fight either. Both had wars with the likes of Diego Corrales and Jose Luis Castillo (Freitas didn't fight Castillo, however). The only great fighter Floyd fought at super featherweight was Corrales. The guy he won the title from (Hernandez) was 32 and had been boxing for 14 years (it was also his final bout).

 

Floyd then moved up to lightweight and challenged Castillo. He LOST! HBO commentators saw, the fans saw (and booed the decision), experts saw, but the judges thought otherwise, as is often the case in boxing. Shane Mosley was lightweight champion from 97-2000 where he ko'd all 9 opponents he defended against. Floyd stayed at super featherweight instead of moving up to fight Mosley.

 

Floyd moved up to light welterweight in 2004 where he fought the trio of Demarcus Corley, Henry Bruseles and the long past his best Arturo Gatti (2005). The same month Floyd beat Gatti, Ricky Hatton beat p4p superstar Kostya Tszyu. Why didn't Floyd fight Hatton next? They were both in the same weight class and both in the top 3 or 4. It made sense. In 2004-05 instead of fighting Corley and Bruseles, why didn't Floyd fight Tszyu, who had crushed Mitchell twice and flattened Judah with one punch (in 2001)? Instead of challenging himself by fighting Tszyu and Hatton at 140lbs, Floyd fought the two guys who Tszyu CRUSHED instead.

 

Hardly inspired choices for a fighter aiming for a "great legacy".

 

He then went up to welterweight and beat Zab Judah for the title in 2006. Judah was at his best up to about 2004-05, particularly when he won the World titles back from Cory Spinks. Judah then lost to the the "Great" Carlos Baldomir and then Floyd. So this was hardly a Judah in the best form of his life. Yet, Judah still managed to trouble Floyd in the earlier rounds. It has often been said that Floyd has a problem fighting southpaws. This could perhaps explain why Judah was able to trouble Floyd early on. Floyd then fought Baldomir himself instead of fighting Margarito, the long reigning WBO champion and easily the best fighter out there for Floyd at 147lbs. Then he fought Hatton, 2 years after he should have fought him, and at welterweight, not at light welterweight where they BOTH were campaigning in 2005. Then he retired instead of fighting: Margarito, Cotto, Mosley, Williams who were all queuing up at the time for a chance to fight the "P4p King".

 

Video clips exist of Margarito confronting Floyd at media venues and saying to Floyd (in Spanish with a translator at hand): "Give me a fight! I will beat you anywhere, any place!" and Floyd seemingly suggesting he would accept a bout if the "business side is right". As with everything it seems in Floyd Mayweather Jr's career, unless the money is right, he won't fight. That isn't how Sugar Ray Robinson, a guy Floyd has compared himself to in the past, received a place in the Hall of fame.

 

Floyd didn't negotiate any of these bouts that fans were hoping for and instead decided the time was right to "retire".

 

Then he returned to boxing and fought Juan Manuel Marquez. Marquez weighed in 8lbs heavier than he had fought in his last fight. JMM was a regular between 126 and 130lbs for years. He fought Floyd weighing 142.

 

This could be an appropriate time to say Floyd returned to boxing in September 2009. When he returned, Antonio Margarito was suspended indefinitely due to the hand wraps scandal. Miguel Cotto had been beaten badly by Margarito a year earlier and was 2 months away from fighting the new superstar in boxing: Manny Pacquiao (who would go on to beat Cotto). Paul Williams was now campaigning at middleweight and had beaten Winky Wright a few months earlier and was 3 months away from fighting Sergio Martinez.

 

Could we make a connection between the timing of Floyd Mayweather Jr's return to boxing and the 3 biggest names linked to fights with Floyd in the past no longer being available to fight him? You make up your own minds.

 

Then came Shane Mosley in May 2010. Fair enough, Floyd finally fought him. Mosley hadn't fought for 14 months though. It is also fair to say that Mosley was in his prime in the early 2000s at lightweight. He beat all of his opponents at 135lbs by KO (except the fight he won his title in).

 

So during Floyd's career he could've fought: SUPER FEATHERWEIGHT: Freitas, Casamayor. LIGHTWEGHT: Freitas, Casamayor, Mosley. LIGHT-WELTER: Tszyu, Hatton, Spinks. WELTER: Margarito, Cotto, Williams, Vernon Forrest, Carlos Quintana.

 

All were in or around his weight category during his career. These are 10 fighters who all deserved a shot at Floyd and at some point in their career were ranked very favourably on the p4p list.

 

And today he has plenty of options out there but will he fight any real challengers? Probably not. Sergio Martinez, Paul Williams, Manny Pacquiao, Andre Berto, Tim Bradley.... There are top names still out there.

 

To be the best, you must beat the best. And he has rarely beaten the best in ANY of the weight classes he's fought in.

 

Pacquiao beat Barrera to be best at featherweight. He beat Marquez and Morales to be best at super featherweight. He beat Hatton (rated no1 by Ring Magazine at 140) at light welterweight for the Ring magazine title. He beat Cotto (rated no3 behind Pacquiao and Floyd) at Welterweight. So he has been p4p the best in 4 weight classes (featherweight, super featherweight, light welterweight, welterweight). I haven't even mentioned Flyweight and super bantamweight where he was champ for a while. I don't know too much about those weight classes at the time. But, i would certainly say he was arguably the best at super bantamweight. He beat some good opposition there like Jorge Eliecer Julio and Lehlohonolo Ledwaba. And even Lucero and Sakmuangklang weren't dreadul. So Pacquiao has been best fighter in FOUR weight classes for sure (possibly FIVE). Floyd: ONE (130lbs).

 

To be the best fighter in a weight class you must beat the top fighter there or at least run up such a convincing run of results that you must be considered the best.

 

Floyd hasn't done that in more than one or maybe two weight classes (130lbs and possibly 135lbs).

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I totally agree with the article.

It would be harsh to call it "cherry-picking" but he has certainly missed a lot of big fights.

If he wasn't running around calling himself the P4P #1, and didn't shoot his mouth off and generally act an asshole outside the ring, then I would certainly respect him and his achievements as a fighter.

He talks a lot though and hasn't fought a genuinely "great" opponent in all too long.

He looks so great in almost all of his wins, it's difficult to pick holes in his ability, and it's difficult to justify a reason for him avoiding so many top fighters for so long.

Is it simply that he is afraid of a real challenge?

Is the smugness and cockiness displayed on the outside, just a front for a real fear of losing inside?

Truly great fighters generally only become so, when they overcome adversity and come through a great opponent to cement their place at the top.

 

Floyd has chosen his career path very very carefully.

He has moved up at the right times, and has often opted for guys who were nowhere near his class.

It is easy to look good against fighters who are not at your level.

It is a lot more difficult to do it against supremely talented boxers.

You don't become P4P #1 without a real defining fight, and generally by removing all challengers around you.

He has NEVER done that, and while the ability to move up in weight and still remain at the top is rare, and generally to be applauded, I think in Floyd's case, it has simply ALLOWED him to avoid the REAL challengers for so long.

 

Like I say, I think he is a supremely talented boxer, but in some cases, that isn't anywhere near enough to make someone a great, and will he be remembered fondly if he retired tomorrow?

I would suggest not.

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Wow. That is along list of people he could have but never did fight: SUPER FEATHERWEIGHT: Freitas, Casamayor. LIGHTWEGHT: Freitas, Casamayor, Mosley. LIGHT-WELTER: Tszyu, Hatton, Spinks. WELTER: Margarito, Cotto, Williams, Vernon Forrest, Carlos Quintana.

 

Great read Londoner. Kind of makes you think why, he never fought these guys.

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He didn't fight Casamayor or Freitas but overall his resume at 130 is very good.He beat several of the top fighters within that division before moving up to lightweight.In 2001 alone he beat Corrales,Hernandez and Chavez - the latter two giving Morales all he could handle a few years later.

 

 

I thought he lost to Castillo but I didn't have it by such a wide margin that Mayweather had no argument or deserving the decision.He did rematch him and beat him.His resume here is a little sketchy as the divison wasn't much at the time,but Mayweather did atleast beat a very good fighter in Castillo.

 

 

 

It's only at welterweight where I think Mayweather has blatantly avoided other opponents.There was absolutely no reason that a fight with Miguel Cotto shouldn't have happened in 2008.This would have been a huge sell,would have made Mayweather alot of money and it would have given a win over an elite fighter in his prime.That was all set up perfectly for Mayweather and he just walked away from it

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Excellent summary of his career, and I agree. But this is why I support Pacquiao. As well as having an exciting style (got to give Floyd his due, he has fantastic technical skill!), he's fought, and beat the opponents that matter to the public.

 

That is what has let Floyd down. He could have got there first, but he chose not to.

 

And now, I think inactivity is also becoming a major factor. It's been 8 months since Floyd was last seen in the ring, and there is still no word on another go. It's 2011, it will be four years since the Hatton fight this year, and Floyd has only fought twice since December, 2007.

 

I think if nothing is announced by May (12 months since the Mosley fight) then every organisation, magazine and related boxing websites should remove him from their rankings because it's not fair that other fighters, who do work hard to get that P4P ranking, such as Martinez and Hopkins, are shafted by a part time worker.

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he's fought, and beat the opponents that matter to the public.

 

He's fought some of them, but most of them either late in their careers.

 

Fights I give Pacquiao great credit for: Barrera 1, Morales 1 and 2, Marquez 1 and 2, Hatton, Cotto(even that one is overshadowed slightly by the weight demand), Barrera 2 and Clottey(hardly Pacquiao's fault the last two were survival-mode fights).

 

I don't really know his career pre-Barrera, but he's not proving too keen to pick the fights the public want to see of late.

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...Lee did you just say Hopkins?...The guy who fought Ornelas and Jones for 2? Those are 2 of 3 fights Hopkins has had since October 2008, yes he's fought PAscal but seems very selective in which "top" fighters he faces

 

I know his opponents haven't been great as of late, Scott, but he deserves a high pound for pound ranking. I never said he should be no.1 or even no.2, just high.

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he's fought, and beat the opponents that matter to the public.

 

He's fought some of them, but most of them either late in their careers.

 

Fights I give Pacquiao great credit for: Barrera 1, Morales 1 and 2, Marquez 1 and 2, Hatton, Cotto(even that one is overshadowed slightly by the weight demand), Barrera 2 and Clottey(hardly Pacquiao's fault the last two were survival-mode fights).

 

I don't really know his career pre-Barrera, but he's not proving too keen to pick the fights the public want to see of late.

 

Admittedly not of late, but he's already done it in the past. If Manny retired tonight or tomorrow then I'd be happy.

 

I actually don't give Manny credit for the second Barrera fight, Marco was old then.

 

Even though the Clottey fight was, to be blunt, boring, the fans on the forums were saying how Manny has picked another tricky fighter, and all that, based on Clottey's fight with Cotto, when the fight was first announced. Then Mayweather announced he was fighting Mosley and the fans suddenly started slagging Clottey off as a choice.

 

The fans are fickle.

 

And like with Floyd's career, we can nitpick all the little details to take away credibility, but it's all hindsight now.

 

The Cotto fight was even going in with plenty of people saying that Cotto will win. People even said the same about the fight with Oscar. Not that I would ever give credit to Manny for it.

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Mayweather tried to get Cotto at 140 and Arum said no. With his ego it isn't too difficult to work out he would fight him at 147 as and when it suits him. Its hardly Mayweathers fault that Margarito smashed Cotto is it? Also for those who like you tube i'm sure you will find tape of Graham and Hatton saying they weren't ready for Mayweather, just before the Tszyu fight.

 

As for the fight happening in 2007, only a complete fool would say that wasn't the best deal on the table. Hatton had jiust finished his 3 fight deal and alledgedly " cracked " America finishing with a stoppage over Mayweathers old rival JLC.

 

It amazes me how green some so called fans are. Some folks really need to get it into their heads prizefighting is all about money, and anyone who tells you it isn't is either a f**king liar, or an idiot.

 

All that legacy and prestige bullshit is to make sure the gullible type of fans keep parting with their money.

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Mayweather tried to get Cotto at 140 and Arum said no. With his ego it isn't too difficult to work out he would fight him at 147 as and when it suits him. Its hardly Mayweathers fault that Margarito smashed Cotto is it? Also for those who like you tube i'm sure you will find tape of Graham and Hatton saying they weren't ready for Mayweather, just before the Tszyu fight.

 

As for the fight happening in 2007, only a complete fool would say that wasn't the best deal on the table. Hatton had jiust finished his 3 fight deal and alledgedly " cracked " America finishing with a stoppage over Mayweathers old rival JLC.

 

It amazes me how green some so called fans are. Some folks really need to get it into their heads prizefighting is all about money, and anyone who tells you it isn't is either a f**king liar, or an idiot.

 

All that legacy and prestige B*lls**t is to make sure the gullible type of fans keep parting with their money.

 

I agree that prizefighting is all about money.

It's just unfortunate that in this era you can get the same money for fighting a bum (Berto vs anyone, Haye vs Harrison) or in some cases even more, because a lesser opponent will look for less of the purse by virtue, than you can earn by fighting your major challengers in the division.

Is it Floyd's fault that he has been able to earn more money fighting a collection of mismatches (in some, not all cases)? No it isn't, it's the fault of the tv networks.

Is he the only one doing it? No, far from it.

 

The legacy and prestige "bullshit" as you like to call it, is effectively down to a fan's own outlook on a particular boxers career, and I don't think there's anyone around today who can live up to the great fighters of the past, who were generally underpaid, overworked, and fought a collection of the very best fighters out there to EARN their respect.

Mayweather turns in a great performance against a sub-par opponent (for one reason or another) and then asks for the same respect and acknowledgement that he would actually deserve by fighting some of the real challengers in or around welterweight, when it is clearly evident that he HAS taken the money fights.

Pacquiao is also guilty of this though, and he hardly gets away scot-free.

In some examples, he is as bad, if not worse (147 lbs Oscar, Morales 3).

Generally, he has made up for these with some significant wins dusted in about the relatively poor fights though, and I wish I could say the same about Mayweather's recent career.

There's a couple of bouts in there, that I do give him respect for, and it's only in retrospect that he's being knocked for it (i.e. Hatton @ 147 lbs - everyone wanted to see the fight, a lot of people still fancied Ricky to win, despite him being out of his depth at Welterweight, he WAS still unbeaten, but ultimately he made it look easy, and it became too easy to knock Mayweather for not meeting Hatton halfway, or in the division he could also still easily make weight for).

A lot of the criticism Mayweather receives is unjust, but he really doesn't do himself any favours by neglecting the very division he has been in for the best part of 5 or 6 years now.

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"Its hardly Mayweathers fault that Margarito smashed Cotto is it?".

 

Mayweather had already retired by then.

 

This is also Floyd's excuse for never fighting. Like he says in his argument with RA the rugged man: "All these guys keep losing to each other. I ain't never lost!".

 

RA correctly points out: "Yeah, they lose cos they always fight each other! When cats fight, they lose! When you always fight the best, you lose".

 

Imagine if Froch wasn't ever considered a good fighter again after he lost to Kessler. We'd have never seen him put on the great performance against Arthur Abraham.

 

Imagine if Ali had packed it in after losing to Joe Frazier. We'd have never seen 50% of his greatest wins.

 

As for legacies, it's tough for modern day fighters. Because it's going to be very tough for them ever to match up to boxers of the past. They don't fight as much now, there is more politics, more money for mediocre bouts etc.... No point in fighting the very best to earn a fortune because a boxer can earn a lot by fighting easier bouts.

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Even though the Clottey fight was, to be blunt, boring, the fans on the forums were saying how Manny has picked another tricky fighter, and all that, based on Clottey's fight with Cotto, when the fight was first announced. Then Mayweather announced he was fighting Mosley and the fans suddenly started slagging Clottey off as a choice.

 

The fans are fickle.

 

And like with Floyd's career, we can nitpick all the little details to take away credibility, but it's all hindsight now.

 

The Cotto fight was even going in with plenty of people saying that Cotto will win. People even said the same about the fight with Oscar. Not that I would ever give credit to Manny for it.

 

Agreed, Skav, in fact I think that both guys being in direct competition with each other, if not in terms of being rivals in the same weight range then certainly with regard to the P4P Rankings, has caused each to get a lot of "hindsight fickleness". It's sometimes funny that the same people that badmouth EITHER guy for the outcome are usually the same ones who insisted they'd lose the suddenly now turned "easy" fight.

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Even though the Clottey fight was, to be blunt, boring, the fans on the forums were saying how Manny has picked another tricky fighter, and all that, based on Clottey's fight with Cotto, when the fight was first announced. Then Mayweather announced he was fighting Mosley and the fans suddenly started slagging Clottey off as a choice.

 

The fans are fickle.

 

And like with Floyd's career, we can nitpick all the little details to take away credibility, but it's all hindsight now.

 

The Cotto fight was even going in with plenty of people saying that Cotto will win. People even said the same about the fight with Oscar. Not that I would ever give credit to Manny for it.

 

I agree.

 

The Clottey fight was initially considered a good challenge as Clottey was a tough competitor who had fought some big names and was ranked in the top 5 or 6 welterweights in the World. The Floyd-Mosley bout was soon signed and the Floyd vs Pacquiao fans swung into action comparing the two bouts and then the Clottey bout suddenly became mediocre over night.

 

In the long term it won't affect Pacquiao's legacy as historians know what they're doing, but in the short term we have to listen to peoples' drivel.

 

Cotto was a great win and so many people were predicting Cotto's body punches would be too much.

 

As for De La Hoya, i had a mate who put a couple of hundred pounds on Oscar to win while i was with him in the bookies. Oscar was the favourite. I kept telling him not to do it and that Pacquiao was going to destroy him and he kept telling me Pacquaio can't beat this guy.

 

In fact, people were actually WORRIED about Pacquiao's health going into the bout suggesting this was a David and Goliath bout.

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Even though the Clottey fight was, to be blunt, boring, the fans on the forums were saying how Manny has picked another tricky fighter, and all that, based on Clottey's fight with Cotto, when the fight was first announced. Then Mayweather announced he was fighting Mosley and the fans suddenly started slagging Clottey off as a choice.

 

The fans are fickle.

 

And like with Floyd's career, we can nitpick all the little details to take away credibility, but it's all hindsight now.

 

The Cotto fight was even going in with plenty of people saying that Cotto will win. People even said the same about the fight with Oscar. Not that I would ever give credit to Manny for it.

 

I agree.

 

The Clottey fight was initially considered a good challenge as Clottey was a tough competitor who had fought some big names and was ranked in the top 5 or 6 welterweights in the World. The Floyd-Mosley bout was soon signed and the Floyd vs Pacquiao fans swung into action comparing the two bouts and then the Clottey bout suddenly became mediocre over night.

 

In the long term it won't affect Pacquiao's legacy as historians know what they're doing, but in the short term we have to listen to peoples' drivel.

 

Cotto was a great win and so many people were predicting Cotto's body punches would be too much.

 

As for De La Hoya, i had a mate who put a couple of hundred pounds on Oscar to win while i was with him in the bookies. Oscar was the favourite. I kept telling him not to do it and that Pacquiao was going to destroy him and he kept telling me Pacquaio can't beat this guy.

 

In fact, people were actually WORRIED about Pacquiao's health going into the bout suggesting this was a David and Goliath bout.

 

I was one of them guys. I even said Oscar was being a bully to Manny. LOL.

 

Even when the news came in that Oscar was dehydrated for the bout, I still didn't give Pacquiao a chance.

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It doesn't matter how much you ignore the reality, Mayweather challenged Cotto at 140, beat the shit out of his sparring partner, and still Arum and Cotto bottled it.

 

So he has no obligation to Cotto, during his retirement the exposure of Cotto was there for everyone to see, what mileage is there in it for Mayweather to fight him upon his return? The money is no longer anywhere near as good as it would be before Margarito smashed him, plus there are always people like you that would claim it was down to the beating from Marg when Mayweather beat him. The reason Arum and Cotto didn't want Mayweather at 140 was because they knew he was too fast, and slick for Miguel. Nothing has changed, they are just heavier.

 

As for your Ali / Frazier analogy the fact is there was a Frazier for Ali, and vice versa. There is no outstanding nemesis for Mayweather, despite what the Catchweight champion of bullshits fans might think.

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Fuckin whoopee, i'd still back Bruseles to give Harrison a good go never mind any fool he's beaten.

 

Are you another one who has got a problem with Cotto bottling a fight against Mayweather?

 

There are a lot of people with big opinions and small memories, when they say he should have fought this, that, or the other fighter, who either choose to forget, or dont know how many turned down fights with him.

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Fuckin whoopee, i'd still back Bruseles to give Harrison a good go never mind any fool he's beaten.

 

Are you another one who has got a problem with Cotto bottling a fight against Mayweather?

 

There are a lot of people with big opinions and small memories, when they say he should have fought this, that, or the other fighter, who either choose to forget, or dont know how many turned down fights with him.

 

Put it this way. If Mayweather fought Cotto tomorrow, it would STILL be his best opponent above 135 lbs, let alone 3 years ago when he was undefeated.

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Fuckin whoopee, i'd still back Bruseles to give Harrison a good go never mind any fool he's beaten.

 

Are you another one who has got a problem with Cotto bottling a fight against Mayweather?

 

There are a lot of people with big opinions and small memories, when they say he should have fought this, that, or the other fighter, who either choose to forget, or dont know how many turned down fights with him.

 

Put it this way. If Mayweather fought Cotto tomorrow, it would STILL be his best opponent above 135 lbs, let alone 3 years ago when he was undefeated.

 

mlol/

 

you might be right, cotto would be at least equal with de la hoya who was ranked at 154 about where cotto is ranked now

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1 - "It doesn't matter how much you ignore the reality, Mayweather challenged Cotto at 140, beat the shit out of his sparring partner, and still Arum and Cotto bottled it".

 

2 - "plus there are always people like you that would claim it was down to the beating from Marg when Mayweather beat him".

 

1 - Beating up sparring partners is really neither here nor there. Boxers spar guys who outweigh them by a couple of weight classes sometimes. Jamie Kavanagh has sparred Manny Pacquiao. As has some of Roach's bigger guys. Would Jamie Kavanagh beat Pacquiao or Floyd? He's only just recently made his pro debut.

 

Didn't Spadafora once famously give Floyd "a boxing lesson" in sparring? Supposedly so. But, anybody taking Spadafora seriously, especially in sparring, is insane. The guy has fought one fighter i can name off the top of my head.

 

2 - There will always be people like me ready to claim Floyd only beat Cotto because Margarito destroyed him first?

 

OK, how about, there will always be people like you who won't give Pacquiao any credit because he beat Cotto a year after Margarito beat him? Or won't give Pacqiao any credit because he beat De La Hoya after he'd already lost to Mosley, Mayweather Jr, Hopkins and Trinidad? Or how about won't give Pacquiao any credit because he beat Hatton after he had 1 loss on his record?

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